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The KEY System and BART
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   The KEY System and BART
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   Author  Topic: The KEY System and BART  (Read 693 times)
LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #20 on: Jun 1st, 2016, 11:08pm »
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In 1974 (yours truly was a senior in high school, way back then!) when this photo was taken at the MONTGOMERY station, BART's modern rolling stock and futuristic stations made it clear to all that a new generation of electric rail transit in the Bay area had arrived.
 
It is hard to believe that the KEY trains were only gone for less than two decades when this futuristic picture was snapped.....
 
http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?19595
 
(courtesy: nycsubway.org)


« Last Edit: Jun 2nd, 2016, 12:58am by CLASSB » Logged
LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #21 on: Jun 1st, 2016, 11:56pm »
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Another timeless BART view............
 
http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?19574
 
(courtesy: nycsubway.org)


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LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #22 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 12:12am »
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This KEY "Bridge Unit" clearly has the entire lower level of the Bay Bridge to itself......not a single motor vehicle in sight!
 
Old KEY ads hailed the Bridge Railway as "the most scenic railway ride in the world"; indeed, daily commuters were treated twice a day to the magnificent, vast panoramas of the Bay, which the harried motorists were unable to enjoy.
 
Only the veteran, old-time ferry commuters said they had it better......
 
http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?16265
 
(courtesy: nycsubway.org)


« Last Edit: Jun 2nd, 2016, 12:22am by CLASSB » Logged
LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #23 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 12:29am »
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When the SN abandoned passenger service in 1941, the KEY purchased five cars, refurbished them, and operated them as the "CITY OF BERKELEY" train, on the "F-BERKELEY" line.
 
These handsome cars ran until 1949; one car was later restored at the Western Railway Museum.
 
The ex-SN train (painted in National City Lines colors) is seen here on the approaches to the Transbay Terminal in San Francisco.
 
Hard to believe its all gone now.....
 
http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?16147
 
(courtesy: nycsubway.org)


« Last Edit: Jun 2nd, 2016, 1:02am by CLASSB » Logged
LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #24 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 12:36am »
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This vintage KEY scene at Emeryville is sure to bring a smile to my good friend Norm's face..........
 
http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?16069
 
(courtesy: nycsubway.org)


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Norm_Anderson
Historian
Posts: 1724
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #25 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 10:15am »
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Thanks, F LINE !
 
Those plug-door wooden Reefers are about as many miles from Chicago as Santa Fe rails could carry them.
 
 
Regards,
 
Norm


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LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #26 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 11:20am »
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on Jun 2nd, 2016, 10:15am, Norm_Anderson wrote:       (Click here for original message)
Thanks, F LINE !
 
Those plug-door wooden Reefers are about as many miles from Chicago as Santa Fe rails could carry them.
 
 
Regards,
 
Norm

 
Norm:
 
You are most welcome, my friend!
 
Those classic SF reefers date this old photo as much as the KEY train does!
 
Today, it's hard to believe that timeless scenes like this were once so commonplace.....
 
"L.F.L."


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LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #27 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 1:07pm »
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All:
 
In discussing the old KEY System and the present-day BART network, it is interesting speculate what BART might have been like today had the KEY System rail network survived until the BART concept came to light in the 1960's.
 
What would the new equipment be like?
 
Would they be articulated units, as were the old "Bridge Units", or conventional rapid transit cars?
 
Would these be third rail trains or trains operating from overhead?
 
Would the old "Bridge Railway" have been retained, as well as building a new Transbay tube?
 
I think it would have made for a very different BART system, had the KEY survived into the 60's, and the old system used as a "building block" for the new BART network....
 
"L.F.L."
 
 


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NEFAN
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Posts: 1488
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #28 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 4:32pm »
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I guess you could also argue that by starting from scratch without the Key line, BART was able to build a more modern infrastructure - transbay tunnel and lack of street running as an example.

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LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #29 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 4:39pm »
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on Jun 2nd, 2016, 4:32pm, NEFAN wrote:       (Click here for original message)
I guess you could also argue that by starting from scratch without the Key line, BART was able to build a more modern infrastructure - transbay tunnel and lack of street running as an example.

 
 
NEFAN: Good point!
 
Though KEY trains also utilized third rail (crossing the lower level of the BB), that was about the only smiliararity between the KEY and BART.
 
BART's outdoor ROW, unlike the old KEY routes, eschewed street running entirely; this certainly removed the threat of train/motor vehicle encounters, which indeed happened a number of times on KEY street running lines over the decades.
 
Not only that, it allowed for greater speeds, which would not have been possible with street running.....
 
"L.F.L."
 


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LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #30 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 4:45pm »
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BART's lack of street trackage certainly eliminated accidents such as these.....
 
http://www.newdavesrailpix.com/keysyst/htm/key090.htm
 
http://www.newdavesrailpix.com/keysyst/htm/key091.htm
 
(courtesy: newdavesrailpix)


« Last Edit: Jun 2nd, 2016, 4:59pm by CLASSB » Logged
LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #31 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 4:54pm »
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Here we see a KEY "Bridge Unit" at the shops, not long before abandonment in 1958.
 
Quite startling for their day, one might say that these big cars were the ancestors of today's modern articulated LRV's, that are now commonplace in many cities.......
 
Oddly, none of these cars had opening windows (and, of course, NO a/c!); the cars were initially cooled on warm days by the train crew simply opening the end train doors.
 
Like many suburban commuter cars of that era, the "Bridge Units" were also equipped with window shades.....
 
http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?16124
 
(courtesy: nycsubway.org)


« Last Edit: Jun 2nd, 2016, 7:24pm by CLASSB » Logged
LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #32 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 5:38pm »
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This modern BART photo reminds me of photos I have seen of the PE's rails bisecting the bustling freeways.....
 
http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?19750
 
(courtesy: nycsubway.org)
 
 


« Last Edit: Jun 2nd, 2016, 5:52pm by CLASSB » Logged
LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #33 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 5:54pm »
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A 1950's-era PE photo showing a "Hollywood" car running through freeway territory.....
 
http://www.newdavesrailpix.com/pe/htm/pe064.htm
 
(courtesy: newdavesrailpix)


« Last Edit: Jun 2nd, 2016, 5:55pm by CLASSB » Logged
LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #34 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 5:58pm »
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More PE freeway running.......
 
http://www.newdavesrailpix.com/pe/htm/pe264.htm
 
(courtesy: newdavesrailpix.com)


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George_Harris
Historian
Posts: 3796
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #35 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 8:05pm »
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on Jun 1st, 2016, 9:15pm, LOCAL F LINE wrote:       (Click here for original message)

Ridding the lower level of the Bay Bridge of the electric trains meant that there would now be several additional vehicular lanes.

No they gained 1, that is, ONE additional lane.  Up until the end of the transbay trains the bridge had 6 lanes on the upper deck and 3 lanes on the lower deck.  The new version is 5 upper and 5 lower.  The middle lane on the original 3 lane lower deck was reversible based on traffic, so effectively during rush hour your gain was a flat out ZERO.  Now, those 5 lanes are a little wider.  At the time the Bay Bridge was built the standard highway lane width was 10 feet, and could still be 9 feet in lower speed areas.  The current, and for many years now, at least 50, lane width is 12 feet.  10 x 6 = 60.  12 x 5 = 60.  So what they really did was increase the lane width.  (Theoretically you can handle a little more traffic on 12 foot lanes than 10 foot lanes due to people being a little more comfortable with the wider lane.  I suspect that is not true for the Bay Bridge.)  The Golden Gate still has the narrower lanes.
 
At least they did get one lane out of it.  When the east side of the bay bridge was replaced, at a cost I have heard to be 5 BILLION dollars, they gained exactly nothing in traffic capacity.  Well, you did gain a couple of things with the new bridge. Shoulders, and a bike path.  However, since the bike path does not cross the west side bay bridge it is fairly useless unless your destination or origin is Treasure Island.


« Last Edit: Jun 2nd, 2016, 8:08pm by George_Harris » Logged
LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #36 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 8:23pm »
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George:
 
Appreciate the info and stats; somehow, one additional traffic lane does not seem to have the capacity for "moving the masses" that two tracks carrying the commuter trains of three different companies once had!
 
In the 1930's, the proposed lower level of the GWB (which did, in fact, finally open in the early 60's) was to have carried subway trains of the new IND 8th Avenue (INDEPENDENT) Subway from upper Manhattan to a proposed transit hub in Fort Lee. NJ.
 
When the Verrazzano-Narrows Bridge was being built in the early 60's, there was some talk of the SIRT (then a B&O subsidiary) being carried over the lower level and then connect with the BMT's 4th Avenue line for direct service into Manhattan (the SIRT was to have connected with the BMT via a trans-Narrows tunnel in the 1920's, which is why the B&O electrified the SIRT and purchased new MU cars (the ME-1's) that were to have been able to MU with the BMT's "AB" Standards)
 
With Robert Moses in full power, this extension of the SIRT via the VZ Bridge never got beyond the talking stages.
 
At one time, the Brooklyn Bridge, carrying several busy BRT/BMT elevated lines, as well as a number of streetcar lines, had the distinction of carrying the most rail traffic of any bridge in the world.
 
The last elevated trains rumbled across the bridge in 1944, and the last streetcars made the crossing in 1950.....
 
"L.F.L."
 


« Last Edit: Jun 2nd, 2016, 11:30pm by CLASSB » Logged
LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #37 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 8:50pm »
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"Before there was BART"...........
 
http://sf.curbed.com/2012/11/19/10304316/before-there-was-bart-a-transbay-train-crossed-the-bay-bridge
 
(courtesy: sfcurbed.com)


« Last Edit: Jun 2nd, 2016, 9:32pm by CLASSB » Logged
LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #38 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 9:05pm »
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See also:
 
http://www.7x7.com/secret-san-francisco-the-key-system-1781842084.html
 
(courtesy: 7x7.com)


« Last Edit: Jun 2nd, 2016, 9:06pm by CLASSB » Logged
LOCAL F LINE
Former Member
Re: The KEY System and BART
 
« Reply #39 on: Jun 2nd, 2016, 9:21pm »
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Two more modern-day "freeway running" BART views, echoing similar operations on the old "Red Car", many years back.........
 
http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?51793
 
http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?51794
 
(courtesy: nycsubway.org)


« Last Edit: Jun 2nd, 2016, 9:23pm by CLASSB » Logged
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