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Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
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   Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
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   Author  Topic: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713  (Read 9043 times)
WM734 Fan
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Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #40 on: Jun 6th, 2005, 10:15pm »
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on Jun 6th, 2005, 10:12pm, RDG484 wrote:       (Click here for original message)
Reading T-1 No. 2101 was restored in 28 DAYS!!!
 I am sure they can do the same with 3713 or even 2124 if not for all the political BS that always seems to block everything from getting done in a timely manner.

 
I agree!!!  What they should do is they should give them a date to finnish it.  Example:  If you don't finnish it by xxx  xx, 20xx, than they should do something else with the loco.


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RDG484
Former Member
Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #41 on: Jun 6th, 2005, 10:42pm »
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on Jun 4th, 2005, 2:17pm, PRR460 wrote:       (Click here for original message)
I'd like to see the skyline casing myself, plus maybe the ears.  But let's get her running first!
 
PRR460

 
To get an idea what she would look like with "ears" click on the following:
 
http://lhr.railfan.net/DH302.htm
 
 
and:
 
 
http://www.bridge-line.org/blhs/dhsteamphotos.html
 
Go down and start with the 8th photo on the second link.
 
 
 
IMO, I think the ears would "streamline" the engine somewhat; make her look like a real speedster.


« Last Edit: Jun 6th, 2005, 10:48pm by RDG484 » Logged
565fan
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Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #42 on: Jun 7th, 2005, 12:13am »
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I'm not going to argue about how long it should take to restore a locomotive, since each engine is different.  You must realize that when an engine stops running, it doesn't stop aging.  I remember talking with the project manager on 3713 two years ago, and he was impressed by how great a shape she is in.  Last year was a different story.  As he looked closer, he found more parts needed repair.  While 3713 only ran for 20 or so years, she still is 70-plus years old.
By the way, the T-1 2101 was used for only a few years on RDG, and never in the "ramble" service.  When restored, she was 33 years old.  That speaks volumes, regardless of what history she had in her first life.


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Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #43 on: Jun 7th, 2005, 12:49am »
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you cant hurry the restoration of a steam locomotive, the K4 is a perfect example of how that goes wrong, look how long it is now taking for them to undo what that restoration in the 80's did. Plus, it's a lot different when a locomotive sits outside all those years like 3713 or 1361. Especially the 1361. I'd rather see it take long and be done right.

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West Chester Railroad www.westchesterrr.net
-The Route of the Flying Turkeys!
I lay my head on the railroad tracks, to wait for the double E,
the railroad don't run no more. Poor Poor pitiful me! -Warren Zevon
NKP759fan
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Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #44 on: Jun 7th, 2005, 7:22am »
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My opinion exactly leol & 565fan!

« Last Edit: Jun 7th, 2005, 7:24am by NKP759fan » Logged

Nickel Plate Road "Berkshire" #759
Built: August 1944
Builder: Lima Locomotives Works
Driver diameter: 69 inches
Boiler Pressure: 245
Coal: 22 tons
Water: 22,000 gallons
Retired: 1958
Used on the famous High Iron Excursions
http://www.cr.nps.gov/history/online_books/steamtown/shs2o.htm
3254Fan
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Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #45 on: Jun 7th, 2005, 4:14pm »
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[quote author=WM734 Fan link=board=Steamtown;num=1111626247;start=40#48 date=06/06/05 at 21:27:31]I understand fully that restoring a steam locomotive takes a LONG time and I am all for doing it right the first time.  Thats all good and great.  But 14 years  I don't know about that    
 
 
 
3713 has not been under restoration for anywhere near 14 years! I think it's 8 at the most. Plus more problems were found when they started to open her up. Take 1361 for example. Her restoration was rushed to be completed in a couple months. And look what happened to it. When Bill Frederickson (the man incharge of 1361's restoration) opened up the steam dome on 1361 in 1996, the throttle valve shattered in his hands. That is why 3713 is taking awhile. It will be done right and better than any other restored steam locomotive! I'd like to know where you heard 14 years, that's nowhere near the right date!  


« Last Edit: Jun 7th, 2005, 4:17pm by 3254Fan » Logged

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NKP759fan
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Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #46 on: Jun 7th, 2005, 4:23pm »
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3254_fan is right. The restoration of the 3713 began in 1997. The reason it is taking "a while" to complete is that the shop crew has been working on the 26 the one week, and then the 3713 the next week. Steamtown is working hard to get the 26 operational soon. But once the 26 is out I'm sure the restoration process will speed up on the 3713. But anothe problem would be that the 2317 has to come in the shops for new tires and maybe even a new firebox . We'll just have to wait and see what happens.

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Nickel Plate Road "Berkshire" #759
Built: August 1944
Builder: Lima Locomotives Works
Driver diameter: 69 inches
Boiler Pressure: 245
Coal: 22 tons
Water: 22,000 gallons
Retired: 1958
Used on the famous High Iron Excursions
http://www.cr.nps.gov/history/online_books/steamtown/shs2o.htm
WM734 Fan
Former Member
Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #47 on: Jun 7th, 2005, 4:47pm »
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on Jun 7th, 2005, 4:14pm, 3254Fan wrote:       (Click here for original message)
I understand fully that restoring a steam locomotive takes a LONG time and I am all for doing it right the first time.  Thats all good and great.  But 14 years  I don't know about that    
 
 
 
3713 has not been under restoration for anywhere near 14 years! I think it's 8 at the most. Plus more problems were found when they started to open her up. Take 1361 for example. Her restoration was rushed to be completed in a couple months. And look what happened to it. When Bill Frederickson (the man incharge of 1361's restoration) opened up the steam dome on 1361 in 1996, the throttle valve shattered in his hands. That is why 3713 is taking awhile. It will be done right and better than any other restored steam locomotive! I'd like to know where you heard 14 years, that's nowhere near the right date!  

 
That railroad, (I think its the Nitny and Bald Eagle or something) must have really "abused" in a way, 1361.  I heard they took horrible care of it and what you said shows that.


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NKP759fan
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Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #48 on: Jun 7th, 2005, 7:42pm »
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Hey guys,
 The 3713 restoration was started in 1997, and here's the web page to prove it. http://restore3713.railfan.net/  But, what year the 3713 will be done, nobody knows for sure But from what I hear it's 08' or 09', maybe even earlier than that, I have a feeling it will be done earlier, hopefully I'm right.


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Nickel Plate Road "Berkshire" #759
Built: August 1944
Builder: Lima Locomotives Works
Driver diameter: 69 inches
Boiler Pressure: 245
Coal: 22 tons
Water: 22,000 gallons
Retired: 1958
Used on the famous High Iron Excursions
http://www.cr.nps.gov/history/online_books/steamtown/shs2o.htm
565fan
Historian
Posts: 1029
Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #49 on: Jun 7th, 2005, 10:50pm »
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WM734 makes a good point by saying that many times it is only one man working on the K4 or the P4 (3713).  I'll probably never understand how work is assigned, but I do know that daily incidents change long range plans.  Such is the case now, since CN 3254 had an overheated drive axle bearing on 5-30-2005.  This means someone has to inspect, repair, and reassemble the axle and bearing.  These guys would be working on 3713 or 26 otherwise.
 
By the way, WM734 may have gotten the 1995 date because fund raising for 3713 began at that time, asbestos removal in 1997, ultrasound and project analysis in 1998, before genuine teardown began in 1999.


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NKP759fan
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Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #50 on: Jun 8th, 2005, 1:24pm »
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When the 3713 is finished, how will they "break in" the engine? Will it run yard shuttles or will it's progress be monitored by the FRA for a period of time until the 3713 is certified to run on the main.

« Last Edit: Jun 8th, 2005, 1:25pm by NKP759fan » Logged

Nickel Plate Road "Berkshire" #759
Built: August 1944
Builder: Lima Locomotives Works
Driver diameter: 69 inches
Boiler Pressure: 245
Coal: 22 tons
Water: 22,000 gallons
Retired: 1958
Used on the famous High Iron Excursions
http://www.cr.nps.gov/history/online_books/steamtown/shs2o.htm
S.S.T.S. 6464
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Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #51 on: Jun 9th, 2005, 7:25pm »
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you cant hurry things with steam restoration. You've got to touch all the bases and get things right the FIRST time, because odds are if you screw up there won't be a 2nd time (Gettysburg Ah hem) We're lucky the K4 is going to run again. I saw the old smokebox they have sitting on the junk pile up there when i took the shop tour. The bottom of it had rusted to about as thin as the brim of a baseball cap maybe thinner. These things cannot be overlooked.

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West Chester Railroad www.westchesterrr.net
-The Route of the Flying Turkeys!
I lay my head on the railroad tracks, to wait for the double E,
the railroad don't run no more. Poor Poor pitiful me! -Warren Zevon
NKP759fan
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Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #52 on: Jun 9th, 2005, 9:52pm »
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Hey leol,
 I know the smokebox your talking about. That was the result of the stack not being covered all these years and the water was just sitting in the bottom of the smokebox. Things have to be done right the first time, because probally there will not be a 2nd. The 3713 has come so far from when it first entered the shop in late 96-97.  I can't wait until the flues are put back in, I would like to see how it is done. The restoration of the 3713 is great for me, because I get to witness what it takes to restore a steam locomotive just like it was done in the good ol days . It's going to be great when the 3713 comes out.


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Nickel Plate Road "Berkshire" #759
Built: August 1944
Builder: Lima Locomotives Works
Driver diameter: 69 inches
Boiler Pressure: 245
Coal: 22 tons
Water: 22,000 gallons
Retired: 1958
Used on the famous High Iron Excursions
http://www.cr.nps.gov/history/online_books/steamtown/shs2o.htm
dh7312
Railfan
Posts: 188
Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #53 on: Jul 21st, 2005, 1:57am »
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whats the current status of the restoration ?

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Jerry
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Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #54 on: Jul 22nd, 2005, 9:09pm »
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on Jun 9th, 2005, 9:52pm, NKP759fan wrote:       (Click here for original message)
Hey leol,
 I know the smokebox your talking about. That was the result of the stack not being covered all these years and the water was just sitting in the bottom of the smokebox. Things have to be done right the first time, because probally there will not be a 2nd. The 3713 has come so far from when it first entered the shop in late 96-97.  I can't wait until the flues are put back in, I would like to see how it is done. The restoration of the 3713 is great for me, because I get to witness what it takes to restore a steam locomotive just like it was done in the good ol days . It's going to be great when the 3713 comes out.

 
Here's how it's done:
 
One guy in the smokebox, one guy in the firebox, one guy in the boiler, one or two guys on the floor handing up the fresh tubes into the smokebox. The length of the tube varies depending on its position in the tube sheets. The smokebox guy (who hopefully knows what the heck he's doing) guides the new tube into the proper ferrule in the front sheet, while the boiler guy guides the tube to the corresponding hole in the rear sheet. The firebox guy measures the correct distance for the tube to protrude from the rear sheet. When they're all in, they get rolled and welded, and lo and behold, you've got yourself a steamer on the cutting edge of operating again.
 
That, at least, is how we did it at the NHRR when we retubed #40 last month. Don't quote me, but just ask our electrician - it's logical.


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NKP759fan
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Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #55 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 9:33am »
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Hey AFT,
 Thanks for the info. It must take a few days to install all the tubes, but it would really be an experience seeing how it is done up close.


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Nickel Plate Road "Berkshire" #759
Built: August 1944
Builder: Lima Locomotives Works
Driver diameter: 69 inches
Boiler Pressure: 245
Coal: 22 tons
Water: 22,000 gallons
Retired: 1958
Used on the famous High Iron Excursions
http://www.cr.nps.gov/history/online_books/steamtown/shs2o.htm
dh7312
Railfan
Posts: 188
Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #56 on: Sep 21st, 2005, 12:33am »
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anybody have and updates on how things are going with steamtowns next mainline engine

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Jerry
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Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #57 on: Sep 21st, 2005, 6:46pm »
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Well the 26 project is being put on hold and mostly all the work in the shop is on the 3713. Lately, some staybolt holes have been welded shut, and there is still a a big portion of the wrapper sheet on the engineers side that has to be cut out, because cracks were found. But other than that I'm not sure. I'll be volunteering October 2nd, so I'll get a mechanical overview of how the work is going on the 3713 from a mechanic who is a friend of mine.

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Nickel Plate Road "Berkshire" #759
Built: August 1944
Builder: Lima Locomotives Works
Driver diameter: 69 inches
Boiler Pressure: 245
Coal: 22 tons
Water: 22,000 gallons
Retired: 1958
Used on the famous High Iron Excursions
http://www.cr.nps.gov/history/online_books/steamtown/shs2o.htm
Bruce_Mowbray
TRAINing
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Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
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« Reply #58 on: Sep 21st, 2005, 9:55pm »
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on Sep 21st, 2005, 12:33am, dh7312 wrote:       (Click here for original message)
anybody have and updates on how things are going with steamtowns next mainline engine

 
Ok, Here's what's going on with the 3713
 
@ 2 of the crew of 3 full time mechanics are welding up the bad staybolt holes in the fire box wrapper. (outer sheet around the firebox) This takes a long time to do. Each hole takes about 45 minutes. I am finishing the welding of the new top section of smokebo. I'm right now installing the new channels for the booster and waterpump exhaust pipes that run up to the front of the stack. Next I'll be cutting a new hole for the stack and drilling and tapping all of the stud holes that are needed in the new smokebox top section. I also need to make a lot of studs for the stack and throttle cover dogs as well as new dogs that hold the throttle cover down.  
   
 All of this work is moving along as long as the 3713 crew is not needed anywhere else in the shop.  
 
 I will try to answer any other questions you have on the 3713.
 
 Bruce Mowbray
 Working on the 3713 At Steamtown
 
PS Work is continuing on the 26



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Bruce Mowbray
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Re: Engine Discussion: B&M 3713
 
« Reply #59 on: Sep 21st, 2005, 11:04pm »
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WOW great post and pic, thanx for the info. It looks like a TON of progress has been made since I was up there last in May. Can't wait to see and hear that beauty out and about. Hopefully she can make some long extended mileage excursions or something to celebrate her completion. Also can't wait to ride in the yard shuttle and also get pictures of little #26 when she is done. Besides those two how is the K4?

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West Chester Railroad www.westchesterrr.net
-The Route of the Flying Turkeys!
I lay my head on the railroad tracks, to wait for the double E,
the railroad don't run no more. Poor Poor pitiful me! -Warren Zevon
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