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Through cars/commuter cars/rail cars
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   Author  Topic: Through cars/commuter cars/rail cars  (Read 5451 times)
Norm_Anderson
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Posts: 1724
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #420 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 12:30am »
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on Apr 19th, 2012, 12:40pm, HARRY FOSTER MALONE ESQ wrote:       (Click here for original message)
Vern.....
 
Recall, too, the SP's only RDC ("The Pocket Streamliner", its official name in TT's), operating between Oakland Mole and Sacramento (85.5 miles)......
 
"H.F.M."
 
http://www.sunnyfortuna.com/railroad/images/nwp22.jpg

 
 
HFM, this appears to be Train No. 4, the Redwood, operating northbound on SP subsidiary Northwestern Pacific.  The line ran north from San Rafael through Santa Rosa, Ukiah, and Willitts to Eureka on the northern California coast.  I rode this train once in the late 1960s-- by that time the RDC was running "solo," between Eureka and Willits (connections to the Bay Area were via Western Greyhound Lines).  It was an interesting trip along the rugged Eel River Canyon and through the redwood groves.
 
 
Regards,
 
Norm


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Norm_Anderson
Historian
Posts: 1724
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #421 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 12:43am »
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on Apr 21st, 2012, 9:22pm, HARRY FOSTER MALONE ESQ wrote:       (Click here for original message)
Prior to its abandonment in 1968, SP's "LARK" played a part in Penninsula commuter service.
 
On the southbound trip, #76 departed San Francisco about 9PM, and stopped at Burlingame, Palo Alto, and San Jose.
 
On the northbound trip from Los Angeles, #75 made the same stops between San Jose and San Francisco, and arrived at the Third Street terminal during the morning rush hour at 8:30AM.......
 
(Source: "COMMUTER RAILROADS", By Patrick C. Dorin)
 
See:
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Southern_Pacific_The_Lark_1965.JPG

 
HFM,, and Vern,
 
In the final few years before the railroads threw in the towel on long-distance passenger service, they probably accepted any passenger who was willing to purchase a ticket.  In the Lark's heyday, of course, these "suburban" stops would have been "receive-only" outbound and "discharge-only" inbound; but by the 1960s they probably wouldn't turn their nose up at anyone (and I'll bet there were plenty of empty seats).
 
Just prior to Amtrak, my brothers and I would head down to Los Angeles' Union Station for a day of train-watching; and if we wished, a ticket agent would sell us a coach ticket to suburban Pasadena on the Grand Canyon (the all-stops "accommodation run").  It was faster (and cheaper!!) than the city bus.  For the princely sum of fifty-two cents (probably a little under $3 in today's currency), we got to walk through the train gates and up to the platform, and board a Chicago-bound train and ride it for half an hour to Pasadena.  It was, by far, the best deal in town.
 
 
Regards,
 
Norm


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HARRY FOSTER MALONE ESQ
Former Member
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #422 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 12:53am »
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Norm.....
 
As always, greatly appreciate your participation and input!
 
Quite awhile back, I read that, sometime in the late 40's, there was a KEY SYSTEM strike, and some commuters got around this by catching SP through trains to Oakland Mole, and then riding the ferries into San Francisco.
 
Recall, by this time, it was nearly a decade since SP commuter service (via the "RED ELECRICS") had stopped operating to the Pier, and began running over the lower level of the Bay Bridge, and into the new Transbay Terminal, although only operating until 1941......
 
"H.F.M."
 


« Last Edit: Apr 23rd, 2012, 2:32am by NH_FL9_2017 » Logged
HARRY FOSTER MALONE ESQ
Former Member
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #423 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 1:11am »
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While discussing Western lines, here is an interesting page on LIRR parlor car (#2072) "TUCKAPAUSHA".
 
Built by ACF in 1949 for the UP, this car ("FAYETTE RIVER", #6027) was originally a club-lounge, and was aquired by the LIRR in 1969......
 
http://www.dominionrailvoyages.com/jhd/lirr/tuckapausha.html


« Last Edit: Apr 23rd, 2012, 1:52am by NH_FL9_2017 » Logged
HARRY FOSTER MALONE ESQ
Former Member
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #424 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 1:43am »
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Ex-SF coach (#3094) at Waldwick, NJ (E-L), 1970.
 
Note that only NJDOT insignias decorate this car......
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/njdot/njt-co3094bjh.jpg


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HARRY FOSTER MALONE ESQ
Former Member
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #425 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 1:50am »
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"Twilight of the Fallen Flags", 1976 (Bay Head yard)
 
Conrail will soon be the "new order", and the seperate identities of the CNJ and the PC will soon vanish forever.....
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/njdot/njt-engines-abp.jpg


« Last Edit: Apr 23rd, 2012, 1:51am by NH_FL9_2017 » Logged
HARRY FOSTER MALONE ESQ
Former Member
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #426 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 1:58am »
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This grimy vehicle (at Middlesex, 1980) represents another second-hand through car, operating on the former CNJ.
 
Note that the car is sporting a CNJ "Liberty" herald.
 
Most (but not all) of the second-hand cars recieved only NJDOT emblems......
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/njdot/njt-coach-kga.jpg


« Last Edit: Apr 23rd, 2012, 2:17am by NH_FL9_2017 » Logged
HwyHaulier
Historian
Posts: 3433
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #427 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 7:07am »
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NORM - HFM - All -  
 
Ref.: ESPEE #75 & #76 - THE LARK. Guess older public Timetables their own reward? I was first in Northern California in 1965.  
So, I had missed the presence of the DAYLIGHT steam power on San Jose - San Francisco runs (i.e., the "Commute" line). Also,  
no "hard data" at hand about past practices with THE LARK.
 
Considering timing of schedules, with #76 possibly a few "local" riders on the SF - Burlingame - Palo Alto - San Jose points.  
In the mornings with #75, should have been no problem, as "long" through riders would alight at the intermediate stops.
 
The Bay Area "Commute" Line a bit of a political football, anyway. Surely, the ESPEE worked it so that actions would pacify the PUC...
 
Norm, and your Reply here dated 12:30a: Concur the photo of N W P #4. Does the photo catch them pulling a trailer with the RDC?  
BUDD did not approve of the practice.
 
.......................Vern.....................


« Last Edit: Apr 23rd, 2012, 7:11am by HwyHaulier » Logged

Ticket Agent serving...Pacific Stage Lines...Washington State System...Mt. Hood Stages...Pickwick Stages...Transcontinental & Western Air Lines.... Admitted Gold Bug..... Observant Orthodox Mossback..... H.M.R.A.O. Curmudgeons......
Norm_Anderson
Historian
Posts: 1724
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #428 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 9:28am »
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on Apr 23rd, 2012, 7:07am, HwyHaulier wrote:       (Click here for original message)

 
Norm, and your Reply here dated 12:30a: Concur the photo of N W P #4. Does the photo catch them pulling a trailer with the RDC?  
BUDD did not approve of the practice.
 
.......................Vern.....................

 
 
Vern, you are correct.  In fact, my eyes seem to see at least two trailers behind the RDC.  This was a bit before my time-- I have no idea what configuration those trailers were (though they look, to me, to be of traction origin).
 
Over on the "Regional Area Operations" board, under "California," there is a thread titled "Redwood Country" that includes a couple of photos I took of this RDC in 1967 or 1968 at Willitts.  Note the "bloody nose" that had been applied to the front, and the unusual "blind end" on the rear . . .
 
 
Regards,
 
Norm


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jmlaboda
Historian
Posts: 389
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #429 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 9:43am »
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"In fact, my eyes seem to see at least two trailers behind the RDC."
 
What you are seeing in that photo is not trailers... its two California Western motor cars, which also operated out of that same station.


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jerry
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jmlaboda
Historian
Posts: 389
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #430 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 9:51am »
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"What you are seeing in that photo is not trailers... its two California Western motor cars, which also operated out of that same station."
 
Looking at the door openings on the first car behind SP 10 I would venture to say that it is CWR 200...
 
What you are seeing in that photo is not trailers... its two California Western motor cars, which also operated out of that same station.


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jerry
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HARRY FOSTER MALONE ESQ
Former Member
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #431 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 10:18am »
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Gentlemen:
 
Regarding SP "commutes"......
 
Back in the day, SP was, without a doubt, the undisputed king of heavy rail commuter operations on the West Coast.
 
Recall,  pre-1939, the extensive electric suburban operaions which radiated out of Oakland Pier, as well as operating "the world's largest ferry fleet".
 
Plus, the commute operations out of Third Sreet.
 
Too, it was the only "big time" heavy rail suburban operation west of Chicago.
 
As of 1969, the SP was operating 44 suburban trains on weekdays.......
 
"H.F.M."


« Last Edit: Apr 23rd, 2012, 10:18am by NH_FL9_2017 » Logged
HARRY FOSTER MALONE ESQ
Former Member
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #432 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 10:27am »
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Two examples of ESPEE commuter equipment, 1970's.
 
The standard arch roof coach is of a general design used by other roads (including the CNJ and the RDG).
 
The double-deck unit is of a type once commonplace in and around Chicago; recall that the original CN&W double-deckers inspired similiar designs for some of the road's through equipment.....
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/sp/sp-c2119wba.jpg
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/sp/sp-c8727wba.jpg


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HARRY FOSTER MALONE ESQ
Former Member
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #433 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 10:41am »
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Two SP scenes at San Francisco, early 70's......
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/sp/sp-sfosta-wba.jpg
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/sp/sp-c2000wba.jpg


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HARRY FOSTER MALONE ESQ
Former Member
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #434 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 10:47am »
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Change the paint and lettering on that big, beefy F-M and this could very well be a scene on the CNJ, prior to 1969!<G>
 
Whatever road these behemoths operated over, they exuded a disinct aura of raw, untamed, brute-force power.......
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/sp/sp3024dsa.jpg


« Last Edit: Apr 23rd, 2012, 10:49am by NH_FL9_2017 » Logged
HwyHaulier
Historian
Posts: 3433
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #435 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 11:21am »
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on Apr 23rd, 2012, 10:41am, HARRY FOSTER MALONE ESQ wrote:       (Click here for original message)
Two SP scenes at San Francisco, early 70's......
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/sp/sp-sfosta-wba.jpg
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/sp/sp-c2000wba.jpg

HFM -  
 
Cars 2000 and 2119 characterized as HARRIMAN design. Seen on ESPEE, UPRR, IC Railroads. With these two  
ESPEE Cars (and IIRC) many, if not all, built at BETHLEHEM STEEL facility at South San Francisco, ca. 1926...
 
.............................Vern........................


« Last Edit: Apr 23rd, 2012, 11:26am by HwyHaulier » Logged

Ticket Agent serving...Pacific Stage Lines...Washington State System...Mt. Hood Stages...Pickwick Stages...Transcontinental & Western Air Lines.... Admitted Gold Bug..... Observant Orthodox Mossback..... H.M.R.A.O. Curmudgeons......
HARRY FOSTER MALONE ESQ
Former Member
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #436 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 11:51am »
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Vern.....
 
By the 1960's, similiar arch-roof coaches were being used by the ailing NYS&W; these cars were true wandering nomads, being built for the Boston & Albany, later being sold to the D&H, before finally coming down to the NYS&W for commuter service.
 
The road's Budd-built coaches were sold and replaced with these older. arch roof cars in the early 60's.
 
Though the road's RDC's (sold to the CNJ) were of course a/c'd, the NYS&W declined the option for the Budd coaches.
 
These virtually new locomotive-hauled cars were sold off to Saudi Arabia in 1961.....
 
"H.F.M."


« Last Edit: Apr 23rd, 2012, 12:05pm by NH_FL9_2017 » Logged
HwyHaulier
Historian
Posts: 3433
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #437 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 12:59pm »
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on Apr 23rd, 2012, 11:51am, HARRY FOSTER MALONE ESQ wrote:       (Click here for original message)
...By the 1960's, similiar arch-roof coaches were being used by the ailing NYS&W; these cars were true wandering nomads,  
being built for the Boston & Albany, later being sold to the D&H, before finally coming down to the NYS&W for commuter service...  

HFM -  
 
"Similar" appearance? But, precisely the same? HARRIMAN design peculiar to a short list of Western Lines. An Eastern Area  
exception in C & O, result of an influence of HARRIMAN money, also in the Newport News, VA Ship Yard.
 
HARRIMAN types on Boston & Albany? Seen any Photo links on this one?
 
............................Vern...................


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Ticket Agent serving...Pacific Stage Lines...Washington State System...Mt. Hood Stages...Pickwick Stages...Transcontinental & Western Air Lines.... Admitted Gold Bug..... Observant Orthodox Mossback..... H.M.R.A.O. Curmudgeons......
HARRY FOSTER MALONE ESQ
Former Member
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #438 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 12:59pm »
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Ex-NYS&W commuter coach (ex-D&H/B&A) in MOW service......
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/nysw/nysw-co00akg.jpg


« Last Edit: Apr 23rd, 2012, 1:00pm by NH_FL9_2017 » Logged
HARRY FOSTER MALONE ESQ
Former Member
Re: Through cars/commuter cars
 
« Reply #439 on: Apr 23rd, 2012, 1:04pm »
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on Apr 23rd, 2012, 12:59pm, HwyHaulier wrote:       (Click here for original message)

HFM -  
 
"Similar" appearance? But, precisely the same? HARRIMAN design peculiar to a short list of Western Lines. An Eastern Area  
exception in C & O, result of an influence of HARRIMAN money, also in the Newport News, VA Ship Yard.
 
HARRIMAN types on Boston & Albany? Seen any Photo links on this one?
 
............................Vern...................

 
Vern........
 
By no means were the cars I mentioned precisley the same as the SP cars; by "similar", I was referring to overall design only, in that they were arch roof cars.
 
The CNJ (as I'd mentioned earlier) had a number of arch-roof "standard" commuter cars on the roster, but, by and large, the clerestory-roof stock made up the bulk of the CNJ's suburban fleet......
 
"H.F.M."


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