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"Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
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   Author  Topic: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"  (Read 2209 times)
SILVER METEOR 158-58
Former Member
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #120 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 9:39am »
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Norm:
 
Again, appreciate your always-interesting input, and also, greatly appreciate your correction on the last new SF passenger power....I had (for some danged reason!) totally forgotten the FP-45's!
 
See what the demands of middle age will do?<G>
 
I think, though, to most of us "old schoolers", the warbonneted E and F units will always epitomize the glory days of the SF........these magnificent engines just shouted "SANTA FE!"
 
See what happens when you're spoiled by perfection?<G>
 
"SM"


« Last Edit: Mar 18th, 2012, 9:45am by NH_FL9_2017 » Logged
SILVER METEOR 158-58
Former Member
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #121 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 9:48am »
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If this shot doesn't look like an illustration out of a vintage LIONEL catalog.....<G>
 
Man, they were GORGEOUS!
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/atsf/atsf0017Cjpa.jpg


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SILVER METEOR 158-58
Former Member
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #122 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 9:53am »
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Chicago, 1965.
 
Guess it's pretty obvious that the SF never "scrimped" on power!<G>
 
I'm sure that even the Mormon Tabernacle Choir would have paled in comparison to the sweet, heavenly chorus being chanted when this photo was snapped!
 
A "Higher Authority", indeed!
 
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/atsf/atsf-f7a-jpe.jpg


« Last Edit: Mar 18th, 2012, 9:55am by NH_FL9_2017 » Logged
SILVER METEOR 158-58
Former Member
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #123 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 10:00am »
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Interesting photo of F-7A #4 on a national tour at Pittsburgh, 1956.
 
Photo was snapped at the old B&O station, long since demolished.
 
Nose of engine is beneath PRR's Panhandle Line bridge......
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/atsf/atsf4.jpg


« Last Edit: Mar 18th, 2012, 10:28am by NH_FL9_2017 » Logged
Henry
Historian
Posts: 6078
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #124 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 10:40am »
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on Mar 18th, 2012, 9:48am, SILVER METEOR 158-58 wrote:       (Click here for original message)
If this shot doesn't look like an illustration out of a vintage LIONEL catalog.....<G>
 
Man, they were GORGEOUS!
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/atsf/atsf0017Cjpa.jpg

 
I have AA and AB sets of Lionel warbonnet F3's. The AB set was my grandfather's and the AA set was dad's, although I think he bought them with money from my college fund! I grew up running those Lionel F3 lashups, warbonnet F's will always be the SF to me. We also had a full set of Lionel's "Silver" series passenger cars to run as our own Super Chief. Of course I still have those too.
 
As a teenager I had an HO AHM ATSF FP45 in the red and silver warbonnet scheme. I don't remember how I got it, but it was a speedster and frequently hauled the varnish on my basement layout. I also had an HO red and silver warbonnet F7 that would sometimes team up with the FP45 to make an odd couple on varnish.
 
Henry


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HwyHaulier
Historian
Posts: 3432
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #125 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 10:41am »
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on Mar 18th, 2012, 10:00am, SILVER METEOR 158-58 wrote:       (Click here for original message)
Interesting photo of F-7A #4 on a national tour at Pittsburgh, 1956.
 
Photo was snapped at the old B&O station, long since demolished.
 
Nose of engine is beneath PRR's Panhandle Line bridge......
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/atsf/atsf4.jpg

SM -  
 
OKAY! If anything, SANTA FE knew how to do publicity. There is a presumption, "...the reason they called the meeting..."  
for display of the new, and thought revolutionary, introduction of EL CAPITAN cars. (Note there were management types all  
over the place!)..
 
And, shed a tear! Yes, the old B & O route, the old "Grant St." (?) (See TTs) Station in Downtown. This had been served by  
local commutes, and the short lived, DAYLIGHT SPEEDLINER...
 
........................Vern......................


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SILVER METEOR 158-58
Former Member
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #126 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 10:57am »
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on Mar 18th, 2012, 10:40am, Henry wrote:       (Click here for original message)

 
I have AA and AB sets of Lionel warbonnet F3's. The AB set was my grandfather's and the AA set was dad's, although I think he bought them with money from my college fund! I grew up running those Lionel F3 lashups, warbonnet F's will always be the SF to me. We also had a full set of Lionel's "Silver" series passenger cars to run as our own Super Chief. Of course I still have those too.
 
As a teenager I had an HO AHM ATSF FP45 in the red and silver warbonnet scheme. I don't remember how I got it, but it was a speedster and frequently hauled the varnish on my basement layout. I also had an HO red and silver warbonnet F7 that would sometimes team up with the FP45 to make an odd couple on varnish.
 
Henry

 
 
Henry:
 
You lucky old dog!
 
True treasures, without a doubt!
 
In my ever-expanding collection, I have a number of made-in-Japan tin litho SANTA FE friction/battery/windup diesels from the 50's and 60's.
 
It goes without saying that the SF was indeed the FAVORITE American railroad of Japanese toymakers!
 
The variety is astonishing, and range in size from three or for inches long, to nearly two feet!
 
One unusual 1950's item is the "MECHANICAL SANTA FE TRAIN SET" (w/box), which, in reality, includes no train, but instead, consists of a wind-up "A" unit (clearly an E) pulling a dummy A, and a circle of track.
 
Another interesting piece (from CRAGSTAN, early 60's), is about two feet long (battery op) and represents two back-to-back E units; the paint scheme, though, is wild.....picture the "Warbonnet" scheme, but in white and red!
 
Unusual, but quite impressive!
 
Another big battery-op from the 60's I have clearly recalls an E-1....quite detailed, as were most tin toys of that era!
 
One could build a collection of just vintage Santa Fe engines alone!
 
Also, I have a few old MARX pieces.
 
Any wonder why I've always been in love with the SF?
 
"SM"


« Last Edit: Mar 18th, 2012, 11:05am by NH_FL9_2017 » Logged
SILVER METEOR 158-58
Former Member
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #127 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 11:04am »
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on Mar 18th, 2012, 10:41am, HwyHaulier wrote:       (Click here for original message)

SM -  
 
OKAY! If anything, SANTA FE knew how to do publicity. There is a presumption, "...the reason they called the meeting..."  
for display of the new, and thought revolutionary, introduction of EL CAPITAN cars. (Note there were management types all  
over the place!)..
 
And, shed a tear! Yes, the old B & O route, the old "Grant St." (?) (See TTs) Station in Downtown. This had been served by  
local commutes, and the short lived, DAYLIGHT SPEEDLINER...
 
........................Vern......................

 
Vern.....
 
Indeed!
 
The SF was NEVER a slouch in any sector, most especially in passenger operations and publicity!
 
IMHO, the SF was, at one time, the most famous and most easily recognized railroad in America, back in the old days.
 
I cannot even begin to tell you how many theatrical cartoons of the 40's and 50's featured/spoofed "THE CHIEF", with some quite realistic-looking renditions of the diesels! (Paramount/Famous Studios in particular!)
 
Santa Fe....class ALL the way!<G>
 
"SM"


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HwyHaulier
Historian
Posts: 3432
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #128 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 11:30am »
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SM -  
 
Trust me! A T S F knew what it was doing! It oughta' be a Case Study in Marketing Classes! Note what they did was create  
a widely known "National Brand" ("Household Name"). That is not easy! They were good!
 
In comment, here earlier, from Les. I have been reluctant to jump right in, because: It was an Era of "Private Market" operators.  
The Railroads had the vexations of the I C C Accounting. We get into some arcane, Accounting Class discussions. That is,  
what the reasonable and prudent distribution of costs of Advertising and Promotion? As the SUPER CHIEF campaign of benefit  
to the entire Railroad, which internal "business unit" should be charged with what, and how much?
 
(This obscure, Dr. Deming stuff. Were too much expense simply assigned to SUPER CHIEF, it would not have net earnings.)
 
See the issues? SANTA FE up against giants (ex., P & G, Coca-Cola) so to create a widely known, "household name" image.
 
..........................Vern......................


« Last Edit: Mar 18th, 2012, 12:17pm by HwyHaulier » Logged

Ticket Agent serving...Pacific Stage Lines...Washington State System...Mt. Hood Stages...Pickwick Stages...Transcontinental & Western Air Lines.... Admitted Gold Bug..... Observant Orthodox Mossback..... H.M.R.A.O. Curmudgeons......
SILVER METEOR 158-58
Former Member
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #129 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 12:51pm »
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Vern/All.....
 
Another timeless SF vignette, this one of an E6A at Witchia, Kansas.
 
This one really reminds me of one my big tin litho jobs......<G>
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/atsf/atsf0014jpa.jpg


« Last Edit: Mar 18th, 2012, 12:53pm by NH_FL9_2017 » Logged
SILVER METEOR 158-58
Former Member
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #130 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 12:59pm »
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1950's SF publicity shot, showing "THE CHIEF" at Fort Madison, IA.....
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/atsf/atsf17abw.jpg


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SILVER METEOR 158-58
Former Member
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #131 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 1:02pm »
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Another (most impressive!) publicity photo, this one of the "SAN FRANCISCO CHIEF" at Glen Frazer, California.......
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/atsf/atsf18abw.jpg


« Last Edit: Mar 18th, 2012, 1:03pm by NH_FL9_2017 » Logged
HwyHaulier
Historian
Posts: 3432
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #132 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 1:22pm »
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on Mar 18th, 2012, 1:02pm, SILVER METEOR 158-58 wrote:       (Click here for original message)
Another (most impressive!) publicity photo, this one of the "SAN FRANCISCO CHIEF" at Glen Frazer, California.......
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/atsf/atsf18abw.jpg

SM -  
 
 
Dates, dates, dates? I am familiar with personal sightings (and pacing) the SAN FRANCISCO CHIEF running with ALCO Power.
 
In this - and the Fort Madison view - SANTA FE in habit of "overpowering" its name schedules. On "East End", Chicago to La Junta,  
CO, near all not a tough line of railroad. "Helpers" needed, and only selectively, at certain points West of La Junta...
 
BTW, and IIRC. The rule being three "F" types with "horse" that of two "E" units. Another obscure reference? Note SAN FRANCISCO  
CHIEF ran via Amarillo, TX, NOT over the via La Junta line...
 
............................Vern......................


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Ticket Agent serving...Pacific Stage Lines...Washington State System...Mt. Hood Stages...Pickwick Stages...Transcontinental & Western Air Lines.... Admitted Gold Bug..... Observant Orthodox Mossback..... H.M.R.A.O. Curmudgeons......
SILVER METEOR 158-58
Former Member
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #133 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 3:14pm »
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Vern....
 
Agreed.....photo dates WOULD be most helpful.....IF they are AVAILABLE!
 
Fart oo often there is nothing in photo captions to suggest a date; quite often, if vehicles are in the view, I use them as a "guide" as to about when the photo might have been taken.
 
"Overpowering" certainly gave SF varnish a most commanding appearance, IMHO!<G>
 
"SM"


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SILVER METEOR 158-58
Former Member
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #134 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 3:19pm »
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Chillicothe, Illinois, 1950 (we've got a DATE here, folks!)<G>
 
"Commanding appearance" fits this stately view to a "T".......
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/atsf/atsf18s.jpg


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SILVER METEOR 158-58
Former Member
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #135 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 3:24pm »
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LIONEL? MARX? AMERICAN FLYER? ATHEARN?<G>
 
(no date/location given for this timeless view).........
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/atsf/atsf21ca.jpg


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ClydeDET
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Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #136 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 3:43pm »
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on Mar 18th, 2012, 12:59pm, SILVER METEOR 158-58 wrote:       (Click here for original message)
1950's SF publicity shot, showing "THE CHIEF" at Fort Madison, IA.....
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/atsf/atsf17abw.jpg

 
Both times I rode the train from Tejas to Chicago, got to Fort Madison about breakast time. Sitting in the diner, feasting on Santa Fe's unique French toast and crossing the Mississippi - ah that was life at its best.


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SILVER METEOR 158-58
Former Member
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #137 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 4:49pm »
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on Mar 18th, 2012, 3:43pm, ClydeDET wrote:       (Click here for original message)

 
Both times I rode the train from Tejas to Chicago, got to Fort Madison about breakfast time. Sitting in the diner, feasting on Santa Fe's unique French toast and crossing the Mississippi - ah that was life at its best.

 
 
Clyde.....
 
Man, I don't think it was possible to do better for yourself than that!
 
If I could go back in time, one of the very first things I'd do would be to hop the PHOEBE SNOW out of Hoboken, detrain at Deaborn, and hightail it onto the SUPER CHIEF!
 
ERIE-LACKAWANNA to the SANTA FE....oooohhh, yeah!
 
"SM"


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SILVER METEOR 158-58
Former Member
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #138 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 4:55pm »
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Had to include this nostalgic old view from 1966 (at Dearborn).....
 
Though the main subject here is an E-L (ex-ERIE) Stillwell coach (now a rider car), note the SF switcher in the right background, obviously poised to do some switching for the next SF transcontinental run!
 
Where did it all go......
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/el/pax/erie-r21.jpg


« Last Edit: Mar 18th, 2012, 4:56pm by NH_FL9_2017 » Logged
SILVER METEOR 158-58
Former Member
Re: "Who Killed The SUPER CHIEF?"
 
« Reply #139 on: Mar 18th, 2012, 5:22pm »
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Two more 1960's scenes at Dearborn.
 
Just a short hop to another platform to board a westbound SF streamliner!
 
No wonder us older railfans were so spoiled!<G>
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/el/loco/erie832ajh.jpg
 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/el/loco/el827bjh.jpg


« Last Edit: Mar 18th, 2012, 5:24pm by NH_FL9_2017 » Logged
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