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Montana Western is out!
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   Montana Western is out!
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   Author  Topic: Montana Western is out!  (Read 4921 times)
Pyronova

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Re: Montana Western is out!
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« Reply #100 on: Oct 5th, 2006, 5:00pm »
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When exploring Google Earth, I found the following....
 
West of Silver Bow, (west of Butte Montana)  It appears that the NP; Butte, Anaconda & Pacific; and the Milwaukee Road all had to use the same canyon.   I have marked what I believe to be the correct names for each line.  From what it appears,  MILW and BAP shared a couple of miles from Butte to this canyon.    Corrections please if incorrectly marked!


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Pyronova

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Re: Montana Western is out!
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« Reply #101 on: Oct 5th, 2006, 5:08pm »
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Here is Silver Bow, Montana.
 
Junction of I-90 and I-15;  Junction of UP & BNSF.
 
Question:  Does UP have trackage rights into Butte, or is it BNSF on UP into Butte?


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Pyronova

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Re: Montana Western is out!
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« Reply #102 on: Oct 5th, 2006, 5:27pm »
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And here is a Pic of Garrison, Montana.

http://Forums.Railfan.net/Images/BNSF/Garrison_MT.jpg
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cmstpps
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Re: Montana Western is out!
 
« Reply #103 on: Oct 5th, 2006, 10:00pm »
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on Oct 5th, 2006, 5:08pm, Pyronova wrote:       (Click here for original message)
Here is Silver Bow, Montana.
 
Junction of I-90 and I-15;  Junction of UP & BNSF.
 
Question:  Does UP have trackage rights into Butte, or is it BNSF on UP into Butte?

 
From what I understand, the entire Garrison to Butte route was originally built by the UP, or some offshoot.  The UP became disinterested in the Butte to Garrison portion and the NP took up that option( thus giving NP a second route between Whitehall and Garrison) , with the UP retainng trackage rights Silver Bow to Butte proper. If I am wrong I am open to correction....
 
Regards,
 
Erik


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OldShayLogger
TRAINing
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Re: Montana Western is out!
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« Reply #104 on: Oct 7th, 2006, 5:54am »
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SPV Mountain Plains Atlas.

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Lima shays!
M19AA
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Posts: 62
Re: Montana Western is out!
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« Reply #105 on: Oct 10th, 2006, 12:05am »
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Why haven't I thought of using Google Earth Good stuff!!  
The tracks are labeled right going into the canyon.
If I'm not mistaken, the NP/BN had track rights on the UP's Silver Bow to Butte line. But I can't be positive about that, but thats what sticks in the back of my mind. We maintained the track and signals, but, there was some billing thing that is back in the cobwebs?
Eric, the reason that the line looks so good is it doesn't have that ugly BN signal/4400 Volt line anymore.
 
Bill


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Butte Wisdom and Pacific Ry.
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Re: Montana Western is out!
 
« Reply #106 on: Oct 19th, 2006, 11:13pm »
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Hello again, it's been a while.  I do have some positive information this time!  A friend of mine who doesn't spread BS from the gutter told me some good stuff from his ties at Montana Rail Link.  According to his source, MRL is pursuing Union Pacific to lease their Silver Bow to Pocatello line.  This is interesting because it was just in August that UP met with Montana's Governor about their intent to sell their only line into Montana.  So our Governor said the State would do more to keep UP in the state somehow.  But, if this branch of UPs does end up being operated by MRL what then?  Would BNSF still try to be a buffer between Silver Bow and Garrison?  Would MRL take matters into their own hands and construct their own line from to Garrison to Silver Bow?  Maybe using the Milwaukee's right of way?  Would the threat of this construction force BNSF to lease the Butte to Garrison line and lease their only island operation to MRL?  Another point my friend's source made was that MRL is still trying to get the Butte line from Logan to Garrison through Homestake Pass.  I understand MRL has some congestion trouble of it's own these days, and they need the extra capacity.  Another man I know who has contact with the mechanical department said that MRL is having electronic problems with it's new SD-90s because of operating in Mullan Tunnel.  So if MRL were to restore Homestake to service, they'd most likely daylight the two short tunnels anyway.  At risk of being labeled a rumor mill, I hate to be the ding dong who posts this stuff and 10 years later things never changed one bit, but then again if it were to happen, I would like to take some satisfaction that I got it right, or at least part of it.
Is SW Montana soon to see some major changes in rail operations?  I know nothing for fact other than what is passed onto me.  If you have any corrections, additions, or opinions, please let me know!


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M19AA
Chaser
Posts: 62
Re: Montana Western is out!
 
« Reply #107 on: Oct 22nd, 2006, 8:05pm »
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Your a Ding, Dong~~~~
 
  Just kidding you know. We need you in on this topic to make it really interesting. Your in the right place to get the info.....
It wouldn't surprise me about the MRL/UP thing. MRL has been looking at the Laurel/Casper/Cody line for at least 6 or 7 years, but they want to many concessions from BNSF what I've heard.
I would think using the old Milw. road bed would be cost prohibitive and maybe not even an option due to land reverting back to original owers.
I was informed that the new engines were starving for air or oxygen going thru Mullan tunnel. I wonder how they will fix that problem.
The NP had a huge fan at the E. Portal to suck out all the fumes but that probably has been out of service for years and might not help the situation anyway. They need air, not to get rid of it. Maybe there are sensors that won't let the motors suck in fouled air. Anybody have an answer??
MRL and BN are both swamped with trains, so it makes it fun to watch the action.
Keep us up to speed from Butte America !!
Bill


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Butte Wisdom and Pacific Ry.
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Posts: 101
Re: Montana Western is out!
 
« Reply #108 on: Oct 25th, 2006, 12:07am »
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Another thing that was brought up about MRL's reason to aquire Homestake, was that Mullan Tunnel is showing signs of a possible cave-in that would require a very extensive time out of service.  I understand that when the tunnel had a major cave-in in 1949, that it took 6 months or more to fix it.  I'm not an expert on tunnel repair, but it would not seem to be a task that could be completed between scheduled freights.  Have any of you heard about problems with Mullan Tunnel?

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M19AA
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Posts: 62
Re: Montana Western is out!
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« Reply #109 on: Oct 25th, 2006, 2:21pm »
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Hi,
Mullan tunnel has always had problems since it was built. Bill and Jan Taylor have written a book about it, Northern Pacific's Mullan Pass. Good reading about all the problems.
I'm going to try to put 3 pictures on here. I guess I might have to do it one at a time.
This 1st was taken just North of the Deer Lodge depot. It was a reroute account of the tunnel being out of service right after the BN merger. There were some big trains run over Homestake during the reroute.  
The solution to the problem would be boring a new tunnel at a lot lower level.


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M19AA
Chaser
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Re: Montana Western is out!
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« Reply #110 on: Oct 25th, 2006, 2:24pm »
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This was a picture of a BA&P west bound west of Durant. Probably take n in the middle 1970's.
These have all been scanned from slides, so the quality isn't the best.


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M19AA
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Re: Montana Western is out!
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« Reply #111 on: Oct 25th, 2006, 2:32pm »
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This is a picture of the last East Bound North Coast Limited power leaving Deer Lodge. Spring of 1971
This is looking West on Milwaukee Ave. Notice the old STOP lights on the mast of the crossing signal. They were kind of unusual.


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Butte Wisdom and Pacific Ry.
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Re: Montana Western is out!
 
« Reply #112 on: Oct 26th, 2006, 1:18am »
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Great pictures!  I really like the U-Boats, the black smoke, the fire from the stack, and they made a nice bass rumble!  I think the NPs paint looked a lot nicer than BNs on those covered wagons, but they weren't that bad.  
You mentioned a lower tunnel on Mullan Pass.  I once heard that BN had surveyed out that very thing.  I heard that it would have started on the gulley floor on the east side downstream below the trestle and the west portal would have came out way down near the bottom of where the grade presently is.  That would be one heck of a tunnel!  I don't think MRL would foot the bill for that one if Mullan Tunnel were to take a dive.  I hope if there ever was another cave in, that no crew is in there.
If Homestake were ever to be restored to service, Highview Tunnel which is just west of the summit would probably have to be bypassed to the side where the NP filled in for a realignment above Highview from the daylighting of the summit in 1955.  The portals of the tunnel are subsiding from the elements.  It's worth the walk down from Homestake Exit to check out.


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M19AA
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Re: Montana Western is out!
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« Reply #113 on: Nov 23rd, 2006, 10:01pm »
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These were taken at Deer Lodge during a reroute thru Butte, account a Mullan Pass cave in.

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M19AA
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Re: Montana Western is out!
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« Reply #114 on: Nov 23rd, 2006, 10:03pm »
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This is another one of a reroute account of the Mullan Tunnel cave in.
 


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M19AA
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Re: Montana Western is out!
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« Reply #115 on: Nov 23rd, 2006, 10:10pm »
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Here is another.

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M19AA
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Re: Montana Western is out!
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« Reply #116 on: Nov 23rd, 2006, 10:12pm »
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and another one.
 


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M19AA
Chaser
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Re: Montana Western is out!
 
« Reply #117 on: Nov 23rd, 2006, 10:14pm »
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This is a Turbo that was tested and it failed to pass as Homestake was too much for it. Taken in Deer Lodge
 


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M19AA
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Re: Montana Western is out!
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« Reply #118 on: Nov 23rd, 2006, 10:15pm »
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Again this is the Turbo that failed.....

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M19AA
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Re: Montana Western is out!
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« Reply #119 on: Nov 23rd, 2006, 10:18pm »
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This is what the BA & P over head looked like to the WB NP trains.

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